saginaw transmission gear ratios
Our t... Start your search by typing in the business name below. Unlimited DVR storage space. The Muncie’s appearance, design, and operation did not change much during the transmission’s use in GM production cars. 284TRAN SAGINAW TRANSMISSION 3 SPD 284-168 Ratios-No Line . I changed out from a 3 speed saginaw to a 4 speed saginaw. To add a little confusion to the mix, there were Borg Warner Transmissions that feature aluminum cases and cast-iron side covers. 17 tooth purple dimension -1.75 x .305 x .810; 18 tooth brown dimension -1.75 x .305 x .810 1.35. I mean they haves higher gear ratios than V8 engines. Ratios can help determine proper application as well as the torque capacity of a transmission. For the amateur, however, around $0will buy a safe, backyard paint ... Weaver Transmission Service is also a preferred installer and repair facility for JASPER Transmissions. 3.11. However, finding one of these transmissions now at a swap meet or salvage yard is getting harder and harder. 2.01. The gearbox on the right has grooves in the Input Shaft making it a 3. By 1963, the General had developed and worked with the Saginaw Corporation to develop a proprietary four-speed (based on components used in the Borg Warner transmission). While it’s obvious that the four speed will use three shift-linkage arms and the three speed will have two, if the first letter is R, then you have found a four speed. PART NUMBER 1 & 2nd RATIOS . Can you change gear ratios in a manual transmission for better mileage? Old Man Engingeering is the leading manufacturer of winning high performance transmissions and gears in NASCAR racing. Household sharing included. – and traction is enhanced, you can figure on eventually breaking the transmission. The average cost for a rear main seal replacement is between $1and $418. Casting Number Year Notes, 3831704 1963 7/8-inch cluster, small bearing, 3839606 1963 – 1964 7/8-inch cluster, 3851325 1964 – 1965 7/8-inch cluster, 3864848 1965 7/8-inch cluster, 3885010 1965 – 1967 1-inch cluster, 3925660 1968 – 1970 1-inch cluster, 3925661 1970 – 1974 1-inch cluster, Casting Year Notes, 3831731 1963 Thin fin tailshaft, driver’s side speedometer, 27 spline, 3846429 1963 Thin fin tailshaft, driver’s side speedometer, 27 spline, 3846429 1963 – 1965 Thick fin tailshaft, driver’s side speedometer, 27 spline, 9779246 1964 – 1965 Pontiac Catalina long tailshaft, passenger’s side speedometer, 27 spline, 3857584 1966 – 1970 Passenger’s side speedometer, 27 spline, 3978764 1970 – 1974 Passenger’s side speedometer, 32 spline. If you are looking for information on what gear ratios your manual ransmission has in it or looking to do a conversionthe following table should provide the basic information you need. Quality Saginaw 3 & 4 Manual TransmissionParts the First Time. The SM4enjoys a very low compound gear at 6. There are several gear ratios for the Saginaw’s. The special 3-speed H.D. The Muncie four speed was produced in two ratios: the wide ratio (M20) and the close-ratio (M21). The Saginaw reverse shift lever is on the cover, and the cover has 7 bolts. The first and most obvious has to do with the size of a car’s engine. I mean they haves higher gear ratios than Vengines. 1.00. The unit on the left has groove on the Input Shaft making it a 2. When looking at a Saginaw transmission, the front input shaft will likely have one or multiple grooves cut around its diameter. 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Will fit the 4 speed saginaws only, Gear ratio 2.54, 1.80, 1.44, 1-1. If the case and side cover are made of cast iron, that would make it a Saginaw transmission. Saginaw 4-speed gear ratios. Its possible to change the first gear ratio in a saginaw transmission from 3.55:1 or 3.10:1 to 2.54? 2-3 days lead time. These grooves are there to indicate the ratios of the gears inside the transmission. You will need a fine scribe or marking pencil that will leave a legible mark on the transmission housing and shafts and a friend to handle counting on the other end of the transmission. One of my more memorable races at Dallas International saw me miss 3rd gear. We promise not to use your email address for anything but exclusive updates from the Power Automedia Network. Now it get the ratios of 2nd and 1st by dividing the bigger number by 1.47. in 2nd case I get 24 divided by 21, cluster gear and get 1.14. This will help you pick the right size tires, transmission and gear ratio combination for your classic. 1.00. We'll send you the most interesting Chevy Hardcore articles, news, car features, and videos every week. speedometer gear in saginaw transmission. When you find a used four speed, a Saginaw and Borg Warner transmission will likely be flash rusted because of the cast-iron construction. 1.00. More manual transmission information, including gear ratio and ID information, is located on the transmission page. The four-speed transmission is very similar to the tried-and-true Saginaw three-speed and fits well behind six-cylinder and eight-cylinder engines. 0 grooves: First … 1.89. The ratio of the four-speed transmission placed in any car was usually determined by the engine size and rearend axle ratio. Use 2nd gear only in the pits or under yellow flag conditions. ... it will easy install wherever a Warner Gear or Saginaw … 1.00. Tooth count 25 21 19 15 15. Registered User. The M20 and M21 used a gearset with a more angled tooth design on each gear (left). Many enthusiasts feel that for a car to be a true musclecar it must have a four-speed transmission. This tranny gets your car out of corners like a bullet. Thanks guys! Saginaw 4-speed gear ratios. Here is a comparison between the M20/M21 gear set and the M22 gear set. Muncie Transmission ID and Ratio Guide. [ February 24, 2021 ] How To Grind Inside Corners How To & DIY [ February 24, 2021 ] … 1st/2nd gear lever is on the right. No lines. © 2017 Power Automedia. The lightest rotating set of gear on the market. Some models may be special build. We said almost all Muncie transmissions had a groove(s) around the input shaft, and that is because most close-ratio Muncies will have one ring around the input shaft. Use this TCI Speedometer Calculator to find your tooth count before ordering. Not only were they both popular transmissions in musclecars and Corvettes, but many were even used after the musclecar era. … But, those built between 1963 and 1965 will not have any rings around the input shaft. Starting with the 1966 models, the wide ratio versions got two rings around the input shaft, and the M22 input shaft had no rings and looks like a 1963 through 1965 wide-ratio input shaft. We’ve sourced more than one Saginaw from Vegas in junkyards. The Muncie is made of aluminum, and will not be rusty looking. 3.50. Now first gear, 29 tooth main shaft gear 3rd in line, 29 teeth divided by the 15 tooth cluster gear it connects with and get 1.93. 2 Lines. While casting numbers are a definite guideline for identification, a quick, somewhat accurate way to quickly identify Muncie transmissions involves the input shafts. It’s no secret that the Saginaw and Borg Warner transmissions were not built to handle the kind of power that a Muncie transmission could withstand. We need to make note that the early Muncie transmissions offered between 1963 and 1965 utilized a 7/8-inch countershaft in the cluster gear, and those manufactured between 1966 and 1974 used a 1-inch diameter shaft. Do you know how to tell the difference between a Saginaw, a T10, and a Muncie four speed? The casting number 3857584 tells us that this is a 1966 or 1970 Muncie tailshaft. These grooves were cut into the input shaft so assembly line workers at the plant could easily identify which input shaft should be installed in a particular unit. New OEM AC Delco gears are used in Muncie, GM T10, GM Super T10, Saginaw 3 & 4 speed, GM T5, Powerglide, 200 & 350 transmissions. TRANSMISSION: 1ST: 2ND: 3RD: Saginaw 3-speed: 1st: 2nd: 3rd No Lines (grooves) 2.85: 1.68: 1.00 1 Line : 2.54: 1.50: 1.00 2 Lines : 3.11 : 1.84 : 1.00 3 Lines : 3.50 : 1.89: 1.00 Saginaw 3-speed. It is easy to determine whether you have an early or later model Muncie four-speed transmission by the way the transmission’s linkage arms are attached. Unfortunately the 3 speed got away from me before I could pull the speedometer gear. We will safeguard your e-mail and only send content you request. Of course, that was many years ago. GM T56 Installation Overview. When properly identifying a Saginaw transmission, the casting numbers are a surefire way to know for certain what you’re looking at. If you're running a rig with a Saginaw 3- or 4-speed transmission and need repair or replacement parts we've got quite a few here in our inventory of manual transmission parts.We've got GM Saginaw transmission parts that fit both 3- and 4-speed manual shifters such as this bearing kit #BK115WS for 1966-1985 model years and includes … There are 2 Saginaw 3 speeds that come with first gear ratios of 3.11 and 3.50, and there are lots of Saginaws out there. If you do happen to stumble across one at a swap meet, do you know what you are actually looking at? You get instant a... Professional automotive diagnostic software. This gear kit will work only on transmissions with. The casting numbers starting at C-9, followed by four digits. Standard Saginaw 3-speed transmission. Manual Trans Reference GM 3, 4, 5 and 6 speeds V24. It would be very helpful to know either how much torque these trannys were designed for or what GM engines they were used with. Select this link to see what models that used this Speed transmission. Put it in 3rd gear BEFORE you hit the accelerator. All transmissions with a 26-spline input shaft used a 32-spline output shaft, and all those with a 10-spline input shaft was paired with a 27-spline output shaft. If it has a cast iron case with an aluminum side cover and tail housing, that will mean you have found a Borg Warner. 1 Line… They were popular in the Muscle Car era. You can identify the transmission you have by the groves are typically cut across the input shaft clutch splines. These numbers can be found on the transmission case, and the first letter in this series of numbers is going to tell you exactly which Saginaw transmission you are looking at. 1.50. Below you will find a detailed list that includes complete rebuilt transmissions, bearing rebuild kits with and without synchro rings, seals and bushings, individual bearings, synchro assemblies, sliders, rings, forks, gears, shafts and bearing retainers. However, there were several design upgrades and modifications made during the total production run. As a rule of thumb, the Saginaw and Borg Warner transmissions should live a long and happy life when used in cruiser applications. Chevrolet Saginaw 3 & 4 Transmission Parts . what rearend and tire size should i run, its gonna be daily driven but i still wanna have fun. The number of times the engine turns past to make one revolution of the drive shaft equals your 1 gear ratio. Saginaw four-speeds were manufactured from 1966-'86, and you can still find them in abundance at your local salvage yard or in many '60s, '70s and '80s donor cars. 245 1. There are no grooves on the input shaft, so the ratios are 2. These grooves are there to indicate the ratios of the gears inside the transmission. Images courtesy chevelles.com. Two areas often overlooked when selecting a transmission are gear ratio and center-tocenter distance. Keep in mind, if you plan to drop one in a vehicle that makes more power than it did when it was stock, you might want to consider going with the Muncie if you plan to beat on it. Saginaw was widely used in Pontiac and Chevy small and mid sized cars including Tempest and Camaro (among others) you totally dropped the ball on Saginaws, here’s the whole story. All rights reserved. There may be other transmission models in which these lengths may vary, but these are the popular models. Muncie M62/M64 — 3-speed longitudinal transmission made by GM; Muncie SM420 — 4-speed manual used up to 1967, very similar to sm 465 except small changes to gear ratios and location of reverse. At age now, I doubt I could do that these days. CAUTION: This transmission closely resembles 343 Saginaw FORD (336) 9-bolt top cover; first-gear synchronized CHEVROLET (341) 4-bolt side cover with round-gear selection shafts TREMEC (352) 9-bolt top cover; first-gear synchronized FORD (337) 4 or 6 bolt top cover; first-gear not synchronized SAGINAW (343) 7-bolt side cover; first-gear synchronized All wide ratio transmissions are designated M20 and close ratio transmissions are designated M21 or M22 … Even the Muncie has its limitations, but they are significantly higher than the Saginaw or Borg Warner. If it starts with an S, you are looking at a three-speed Saginaw. The article claims the Borg Warner was used in some Chevy cyl. 245 1. Click the link! The Muncie four-speed transmission was heralded by many as an “indestructible” four speed used by General Motors, and found its way into many different car models, behind various engine combinations between 1963 and 1974. You can (usually) tell the ratio by the number of rings around the input shaft. Made up to Order. Determining the ratio of each gear in your standard transmission is actually pretty easy. Its possible to change the first gear ratio in a saginaw transmission from 3. In fact it has the input shaft with grooves, and the ratio is low …. New 4 speed Saginaw cluster gear. This early box began its career being placed in the Corvette. Post Jun 15, 2015 #1 2015-06-15T19:04. All rights reserved. Saginaw three-speed transmissions featured gear ratios of 2.85:1 for first, 1.68:1 for second and 1.00:1 for third when matched with L6 in-line six-cylinder engines. Basically, if you are installing one or the other in a car that will be a nice driver and see only minimal, spirited gear grabbing, both the Saginaw and the Borg Warner can be a good and less expensive alternative to the more robust Muncie. The TH400 length and mount dimensions are for the “shorty” tail-housing model. There are a couple of different debates that typically occur when a bunch of car guys get together. Did you know that there are various models that were used in various cars? well i checked what gear ratios i have in my saginaw and i came up with 1st - 3, 2nd - 2.25, 3rd - 1.5 and 4th 1. now i know thats not accurate so i looked at saginaw ratios and came up with 1st - 3.11, 2nd - 2.20, 3rd - 1.47, 4th - 1.00. how will these ratios perform? azmusclecar. Not only are the Saginaw and Borg Warner side cover and tail housings constructed of different materials, but the reverse shifter arm of a Saginaw is on the side cover while the T10 is located on the tail housing. The only way to know for sure is to have them checked. 1 Line . While the big-block vs. small-block variable is one that has two groups of passionate followers, the other reflects the way in which the driver selects transmission gears. Almost all Muncie transmissions were delivered with a groove(s) on the input shaft and counter gear. Let’s find out who is responsible for these. Manual transmission cases can be identified by the casting numbers and casting dates. If the case, side cover, and tail housings are made solely of aluminum, well my friend, that would be a Muncie. We have salvaged more than one Saginaw from cars like the Vega and Monza. This was used in A-body and F-body cars and Corvettes into the early ’80s. When looking at a Saginaw transmission, the front input shaft will likely have one or multiple grooves cut around its diameter. No Lines (grooves) 2.85. Randy Bolig has been working on cars and has been involved in the hobby ever since he bought his first car when he was only 14 years old. His passion for performance got him noticed by many locals, and he began helping them modify their vehicles. Guía con miles de negocios en Mesquite, TX. Chevy Hardcore NEWSLETTER - SIGN UP FREE! Street Outlaw’s 1,100 Horsepower ManVan Is For Sale, Building A ’69 Camaro That Stands Out In A Crowd, On Lock Down With Stage 8 Locking Fasteners, Top 10 Mistakes To Avoid Before Hitting The Dyno, Sweet Street Chevy: Jim Rivera’s Twin Turbo 1955 Chevy, Gear Up For Accurate Timing With Milodon Gear Drive Systems. Gear ratio calculator for your Chevrolet. If you are not sure how to distinguish between an M20, M21, or M22 Muncie, knowing what to look for can be tricky. SAGINAW SPEED transmission - $100. supercars, requires good amount of power or speed, Now the questions arise how does a car gives these torque and speed output? Depending on how you ordered your musclecar in the ‘60s and early ‘70s, you might have even benefitted from the famous Muncie transmission. Muncies are the hot tip, since they usually were used with high performance engines. Late style, notice where reverse is. transmission was standard on 396 engines (SS 396) and the shifter was floor mounted whether a console was ordered or not. The aluminum or iron-cased 440/MY6 helped power 1981 to 1987 trucks, and featured a non-synchronized first gear. The casting number 3925660 denotes this as a 1968 – 1970 Muncie with a 1-inch cluster shaft. 4*4 SUVs, requires good amount of torque and on the other hand the car which has to achieve high speed i.e. Saginaw 4-speed. Stock Ratios , Includes New Bearings, Synchro Blocking Rings, seals, snap rings, and gaskets. ... Saginaw M19 Manual Transmission Overhaul Kit. The Saginaw 4-speed transmission was also used and shown for "M20 PROD V-8 ENG & R.P.O. ... and 1:1 Third gear ratios. Lin-line six-cylinder engines. I can buy a saginaw transmission but this was for an Zylinder car. Because different transmission gear ratios can greatly affect a drivetrain combination, it’s important for anyone performing a transmission swap to know the gear ratios of the gearboxes you might be installing in your vehicle. SHIPS VIA UPS, IN BOX. D & L Transmission To order call 1-631-351-4837. Transmissions customized to fit your tracks rules at no extra charge. First came the Borg Warner T10 beginning in the late ‘50s. The 1964 through 1968 Muncie side covers had a stud coming out of the side cover that secured the linkage arm via a nut. The transmission mount position is also expressed from the bellhousing flange rearward to the centerline of the mount.